liliaeth | Not quite a rant, or is it?

I've been trying to think of why this annoys me so much, the notation on top of spander or spangel fics saying "s6 but without the spuffy" that then go on to have Spike behaving exactly like he did in s6.
See the thing is, Spike only changed, became a better person, because he fell in love with Buffy. The chip had a huge effect, but it was only the start. The chip alone would not have turned him into the vampire he was in s6, it was his love for Buffy that brought him to the likeable amoral guy he was at that point in time.

Take out the buffy love and you take out all the characterdevelopment for Spike. And no, placing Xander in Buffy's place would not have the same effect. Because Xander isn't Buffy. That's not a bad thing, because Buffy isn't Xander either. But it does make a difference in how Spike responds to him.

Part of why Spike fell for Buffy is her strenght, the fact that she can kick his ass without a problem, yet still be kind underneath. (wether you agree or not, Spike saw compassion and an ability to love in Buffy)
Having him fall for Xander would make a difference.

And if you have him fall for Willow, you damn better show Spike in Tara's place and make it clear that Spike unlike Tara would not have the strenght to finally say "enough is enough" and leave for his own good. Because Spike didn't leave Buffy, so he wouldn't leave Willow either. No matter how much she'd abuse that love and would try to control him or mess with his mind every time they had the least bit of a fight.

Yes, I know, I'm biased, but there is a reason why Willow/Spike is one of the few Spike ships that I refuse to read, except in very few exceptional cases (looking at

speakr2customrs here)
Willow would destroy Spike and I love Spike too much to see him go through that.

That aside though. I don't see the need to ignore a previous relationship, just to write a char in a new ship. I don't like Spike/Dru and hate Buffy/Angel, but if I write Spike/Angel, I'll give both those ships their due. Not because I like the ships in question, but because of the effect they had on the chars. Because of the depth they give the characters involved.

If I just ignore Spike/Dru and say it meant nothing compared to the new ship, then I diminish Spike. I take away his immense ability to love. She was a huge part of his life and to ignore that destroys more about Spike than it wins. No matter what the new ship you try to put him in is. Hell I personally see B/A as all about Darla, but that doesn't mean that Angel didn't love Buffy in his own limited way. She was important to him. Saying she wasn't makes Angel less real. (plus I like Buffy too much for that*g*)

Anyway, I have once again, no good way to end this rant, just had to get it off my chest.

Another thing. I keep seeing comments in various lj's about manips and fanart and it's starting to make me worried. Should I keep my fanart to

darker_spike?
Am I annoying people with those teaser pics and should I put everything behind a cut on my lj or should I just forget all about the manips because they suck?

[Poll #560641]

Flat | Top-Level Comments Only

I'm not sure what comments are appearing elsewhere, but I don't have anything against good manips and I like yours especially ... I tend not to be a fan of "someone-else's body with Spike's head and that's it", but yours always have a story or a twist attached

you're good at making sure your teasers aren't too risque and mark everything which isn't work-safe, so I don't mind them showing up in my flist

although I would probably see them in

darker_spike eventually, I don't have it in my flist and only look at it every now and then

ummm ... that's all ...

I tend not to be a fan of "someone-else's body with Spike's head and that's it",

If I understand you correctly, you're not a fan of manips since about 90% of manips are all about Spike's head on someone else's body. That's kind of the point of a manip and the majority of the reason to do a manip.

I don't think that's what she means. It's more that there are some manippers, usually the ones just starting out, who just take a pic and then put a head on it, without bothering to change the skin, or do anything more with it than just put that head in place.

I know that I did a few somewhat similar to that notion. (remembers a certain tentacle manip where she just put Spike's face in*g*)

The difference can lay in the effort you put into having the skin match, in having the colours look so similar that the pic actually looks real, instead of like one where you can see exactly which parts where put in and where the angles are all wrong.

Right?

liliaeth is right about what I meant (although maybe didn't say as well!)

I tend to like them with a theme or a motive behind them (and hoping I'm not offending anyone, coz I really don't mean to) I guess I like ones that fit into a story or what I imagine Spike to be like, e.g

liliaeth has done some fab Spangel ones and I loved

fanbot's fairy manips. I guess I believe this takes a lot of imagination and talent, which is what I appreciate in anything.

Thanks, I'm glad you like my manips. Just tend to get insecure every once and a while*g*

(looking at [Bad username in LJ tag] here)

I would guess that I am [Bad username in LJ tag] here.

Yes, Willow acting like she did on-screen would destroy Spike; but then I think Buffy came pretty damn close to destroying him. I can only write Spike/Willow with a Willow who has learned from her mistreatment of Tara and who takes care not to repeat those mistakes with Spike, just as I can only write S6 or S7 Spuffy with a Buffy who improves her behaviour.

True, it's odd how on the show, only Spike was actually made to change enough to be a decent partner, while none of the writers seemed to see the same necessity for the scoobs. My main problem with Willow in any pairing is that even after Tara told her how she felf about the violation of her mine, that Willow was still going on about 'how Tara left her for no good reason'.

Even her quitting with magic was a 'blame it all on magic' instead of realizing that the problem was with her, not with the magic. I actually see her capable of ensouling Spike without his previous permission, just because it would make things easier for her with the rest of the gang. She'd probably justify it to herself as doing it for his own good.

I keep seeing comments in various lj's about manips and fanart and it's starting to make me worried.

Crap I knew people were laughing about my lame attempts at manips.

I haven't seen any bad comments, but then again I don't have many friends that I read, and only a few select communities. What kind of comments are you seeing? Are they about just you, or mocking of anyone that is just trying their hand at it for the first time? Is it comments about manips made to communities or about ones in someone's own journal?

Sure there are some sucky manips but then again the people that we think of as great manippers didn't get there without practice and without some feedback to help make them better. If someone doesn't want to see it they can just skip over that entry, no one's holding a gun to their head making them look.

Actually I haven't seen anything aimed at specific manippers. (even if I do constantly fear they're talking about mine when I hear someone grumbling about it, yes I know I'm self-centered ;-)).

It's just the general comment here and there about the recent overflow of manips on friendslist and not liking them and stuff. Makes me worried that I've been annoying my friendslist with mine.

As long as they're not too big or risque, who's business is it what you post in your LJ? If they don't like it, they can defriend you.

Keep posting the teasers, they bring people in beneath the cut who otherwise wouldn't have bothered.

Exactly, I tend to notice that I'm less likely to open a cut if there's nothing above the cut to draw my attention.

First of all the rant I agree with. I love season 2 S/B fics but I think you need to also show that he was devoted to Dru before. It is part of what makes him who he is. I have read a few other ships but I am not as into them as I am the Spuffy. I like to have happy endings though not because of Buffy but because they denied that to Spike at every turn in the show and I believe Spike should have gotten what he most desired. He was the most real and best character on that show.

I have a small beef with the way they did Buffy on the show as well. She was lead around by the nose by her friends, always letting them make important decisions for her even when they hurt her more than anyone else could. She was never truly allowed to grow up in my opinion. From the begining of the show to the end they showed her as always loving Angel no matter what. Even in the last season they had to bring him in just before the final battle. He moved on with his life they showed on his show but she never moved on with hers. I married the first man I was truly in love with which was a mistake. He was my first high school love and he cheated and treated me like shit. I got over him within a year of our divorce. Yes I hurt and I grieved but with all the things on that show that went on between Angel and Buffy she was never allowed to get over that first devastating love like most real ppl do. To me this was wrong and the treatment of Spike in season 6 was wrong. Yes it was hot all the sex and such but they never had Buffy realize the treatment she dished out was wrong and for someone who was supposed to be the Chosen One to not finally see what she was doing was worse than most things the other characters had done was just not good.

OMG Sorry see I got up on my soap box and started ranting you can kick me now lol.

See I got off on the rant and forgot to say keep posting your manips! I love them!

Not quite a rant, or is it?

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